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  The Chatter Box : Blathering On
Iraq Again, :-( by tucsonmike on 24 October 2006 3:02am
The Economist had another editorial about Iraq, basically saying the United States is stuck there.:-( I just saw a show on History Channel about declassified info. about the Vietnam War. This is getting sad.

U.S. troops are not dying as quickly as Vietnam, so there isn't the same sense of outrage. Plus, we support the troops this time, not the war.

When I was in New York, I had an argument with my father about this. He supports the war and thinks the United States needs to reinstate the draft. Even American military leaders do not want the draft back. Politically, I don't see it, unless emergency powers are invoked. We are also having soured ties with Turkey. This isn't good.

The British General who spoke out? The sad part is he is right. The only reason we cannot leave is because we created the mess. I was raised if you make a mess, you apologize and clean it up. How are we going to do THAT in Iraq? I do not have that answer.
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by suzulu on 24 October 2006 2:16pm
There is talk about British troops being pulled out of Iraq but Tony Blair does not want it until the situation is better but how can it ever be sorted out? It's all one big mess and I cannot see it ever being resolved.
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by sighthound on 24 October 2006 7:49pm
What else could you expect from a war initiated by a President who had never, ever travelled outside of the US until he had Air Force One at his disposal with security that totally insulates him from real people and real issues and who was coddled in his ridiculous "America First" mentality? Bush has absolutely no background that would enable him understand the world. This is why travel is so important, dammit!!!!

There has never been a time before when I've felt so justified in saying "I TOLD YOU SO!!!" When this war was first proposed, I was screaming "exit strategy?", "what WMDs, where???", "Vietnam all over again", "creating a new generation of terrorists", "why Iraq when our enemies are not Iraqis?" and so on and on and on but in the post 9/11 mindset (turned into hysterics by the media prompted by "conservative" political interests), logic was totally ignored.

Iraq is a quagmire. There is no honorable way out for anyone. The US could, of course, pull out our troops, leaving this horrible mess we created. But then the masculine, military minds that are in control never bother about cleaning up their messes. That's "women's work", of course, but women, both Islamic and Western, would if left unfettered, do their best to clean up this mess. Pardon my pessimism, but I don't think they will be allowed to do that.
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by Ellerd on 25 October 2006 3:15am
Pulling out troops now would be an absolute disaster for everyone. There's no way the government could function in Iraq without Coalition troops. The country would be overrun by warlords and terrorists in record time. If Iraq was a haven for terrorists during Saddam Hussein's reign (as our elected leaders let on), imagine how bad it would be if everyone suddenly abandoned the country? So sit tight guys, I think we're in for the long run. :(
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by pandab on 28 October 2006 5:57am
Sadly, I believe the opinions stated in this topic are absolutely right. We're in a quagmire, but as much as I would dearly love for it to happen, I just don't believe we can leave Iraq at the moment. Not with anything approaching basic decency, anyway.

There is one good thing that has come out of this disaster. An awful lot of Americans are realizing that Bush & Company sold a pig in a poke, and they are finally getting angry about it. I know it is rather late to come to that conclusion, but hey, at least it's happening.

I'm hoping the forthcoming shake-up in DC will do some good. No matter what the outcome, I think this election season has rattled some cages. People are finally waking up to smell the hubris, and our dear leaders know it ... whether they want to admit or not.

Unfortunately, though, we're in Iraq for quite some time yet. I hate that we started it, but since we did, we have to finish it now.

Re: Iraq Again, :-( by tucsonmike on 29 October 2006 3:44am
Well we shall see what happens, November 7th. At this rate, the Democrats are going to win easily. If they do win, then what? Nothing will be done, but some Democrats are threatening to send all sorts of Republicans to jail. (Apparently former lobbyist Jack Abramoff has been given a desk at FBI HQ and is singing like a canary).

I bought Barack Obamas' latest book half price. Bush spoke with him (Obama) when he was first elected. Obama said Bush is very easygoing when he isn't being political. Once he decides something, it is like a dog with a bone. Hence, Bush saying he will stay in Iraq even if only Laura and his dog Barney support him.

Re: Iraq Again, :-( by sighthound on 29 October 2006 9:02am
I don't think that the Democrats are going to win easily but we're going to give it a good try. (I say "we" but I'm not a registered Democrat because I've been so disgusted with the party of late. I'm registered Green but I vote Democrat.)

I was very encouraged today. I volunteered with MoveOn and went through a phone training session today. They are SO ORGANIZED! They've got 100,000 volunteers who will be calling Dems and progressives who didn't vote in the last two elections to encourage them to get to the polls. We don't have to try to convince anybody of anything, just get people who are liable to vote the way we want them to to get out and VOTE. The internet system MoveOn has devised is amazing. Maybe intelligence can finally turn the tide and take back the vote from corporate interests. GO MOVEON!!!
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by Ellerd on 6 November 2006 1:04am
I wonder how the announcement of Saddam Hussein's death by hanging will affect Iraq?
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by tucsonmike on 6 November 2006 1:30am
We shall see. Shiites are celebrating, but in Sunni areas, there have been massive protests.

Just another factor in the mix of the mess that is Iraq.
Re: Iraq Again, :-( by Louise on 6 November 2006 3:15am
Regarding American politics, I`m in contact with friends and family in the States. It`s really quite surprising to hear how many of them have turned to the left, following the Iraqi invasion.

At the beginning of the war I had a little A4 poster pinned to my front door: " Don`t Attack Iraq!" It was subsequently torn down and shredded on my garden path. Wonder if they agree now? Hmmm ...


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